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Target Sights for Compound?

Question:

I’ve got a PSE Supra compound bow on order that I plan to use for target shooting.  I’ve been looking at target sights at Lancaster’s web site.   Many of the target sights indicate they are for recurves only, many don’t say anything about bow-type, and a few indicate they are OK for compounds. I was figuring on spending ~$100 to $150 for a sight, including an aperture.  The top of the line $250 jobs from Toxonics, Sure-Loc, etc. are way too much.  I’m a bit concerned about the AIM products being too economical, although the Champion might be OK.  I’d like to get repeatable settings, preferably with a click adjustment.  The Toxonics Naildriver 3515 seems promising, but it doesn’t say if it’s OK for compounds, and it doesn’t mention click adjustment.  The Sure-Loc Challenger 400/550 is a bit more than I had figured on spending, especially given that I’d still need an aperture.  Any other options? What are the issues with different extension & frame lengths?  I assume by frame length they mean the height of the elevation section, in which case I don’t know why you would need a larger one unless you are shooting at very long ranges.  On aperture/scope threads, I would think that a 10-32 thread would be more rigid without adding much weight, but a large amount of stuff comes only in 8-32.  Any big deal as to which to go with? The Beiter apertures look nice, but I have no idea what the issues might be with a small vs large aperture.  There’s also the Ambo adjustable iris, but I still don’t know why/when I might want to change my iris size.  Different lighting conditions? Any comments or suggestions would be greatly apreciated. Thanks! Doug White

Response:

Generally, recurve bows have less vibration than compound bows. Many compound archers use scopes which are heavier than the simple apertures and pins that recurve shooters use. So, a compound sight is sturdier than a recurve sight. You can use a compound sight on a recurve but the reverse might be trouble. Most scopes have 10/32 threads since they are sturdier. Most simple apertures and many pins are 8-32 since they don’t have to be as sturdy. Generally speaking you don’t need as much frame length with a compound. The arrows go faster and the arrows don’t fall off as much with longer distances. For most uses 4 inches is plenty for a compound. If you have a scope/lens then changing the extension can make the view through the scope clearer. Some folks use the extension length to compensate for bow torque. What you choose depends on the type of shooting you will do. If you are shooting FITA events then you probably end up shooting with a scope (and a peep) with a release. I would spend a bit more and get a sturdier sight. 3D and field have classes for fingers and compounds. Some classes use pins only. Tell us a little bit more about what kind of archery you want to do. — Arlington, Massachusetts USA

Response:

I’ve got no comments on particular brands of Compound sight, I don’t know the market well enough. The following are just some general observations: "click" doesn’t guarantee reliable settings. I’d look for something which is designed to lock down solidly and not rattle loose, myself, regardless of whether it clicks or not. Most target compound archers I’ve seen, shoot with a peep and scope. This has a couple of implications; you need a pin stout enough to support the scope and not break in use (so 10/32 – most recurve sights use 8/32 which isn’t sufficient). The extra weight on the sight pin, plus the mechanical vibration of the bow tend to rattle loose a sight which doesn’t lock down well, so look at how it locks – if it has a 10/32 pin and *good* locking mechanisms (read "overkill") then it’s most likely a compound sight. The second implication relates to the extension – sight picture through the peep is important. You need to set thing up so you can see the whole scope body through the peep, this is part of where the extension comes in. You shift the extension until you get a good sight picture, then you lock it down and don’t move it again. This differs from the way some recurve archers use an extension, for getting longer distances by reducing the length. That shouldn’t be necessary on a compound, even with Aluminium shafts. The vertical travel is another matter, you don’t necessarily need it to be long, but it is better to have it long enough so that you can get your longest and shortest distances without having to take the sight apart and re-position the rail. For target shooting this is 90m and 30m (outdoors) and as low as 18m indoors. With a slow compound, and heavy shafts, some sight rails won’t accomodate this. Unfortuantely, it’s a "suck it and see" sort of thing, as you can’t predict how your setup is going to be. My personal take on aperture size (or scope size) is that it doesn’t matter much. If you get the larger Beiter, then you can always reduce the internal diameter with inserts. I use the larger size (without any inserts) on my recurve, and a 28mm scope with a central dot, on my compound. What *you* should use, is what works best for you. You only find that out by trying things out. Personally, I wouldn’t touch one of the "iris" type sights. Too much to go wrong, and I’d end up leaving it at one size, anyway… a simple open ring, or dot, is good enough IMO. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > I’ve got a PSE Supra compound bow on order that I plan to use for target > shooting.  I’ve been looking at target sights at Lancaster’s web site.   > Many of the target sights indicate they are for recurves only, many don’t > say anything about bow-type, and a few indicate they are OK for > compounds. > I was figuring on spending ~$100 to $150 for a sight, including an > aperture.  The top of the line $250 jobs from Toxonics, Sure-Loc, etc. > are way too much.  I’m a bit concerned about the AIM products being too > economical, although the Champion might be OK.  I’d like to get > repeatable settings, preferably with a click adjustment.  The Toxonics > Naildriver 3515 seems promising, but it doesn’t say if it’s OK for > compounds, and it doesn’t mention click adjustment.  The Sure-Loc > Challenger 400/550 is a bit more than I had figured on spending, > especially given that I’d still need an aperture.  Any other options? > What are the issues with different extension & frame lengths?  I assume > by frame length they mean the height of the elevation section, in which > case I don’t know why you would need a larger one unless you are shooting > at very long ranges.  On aperture/scope threads, I would think that a > 10-32 thread would be more rigid without adding much weight, but a large > amount of stuff comes only in 8-32.  Any big deal as to which to go with? > The Beiter apertures look nice, but I have no idea what the issues might > be with a small vs large aperture.  There’s also the Ambo adjustable > iris, but I still don’t know why/when I might want to change my iris > size.  Different lighting conditions? > Any comments or suggestions would be greatly apreciated. > Thanks! > Doug White

Response:

Thanks for the input.  I will probably be competing in our local club shoots, and I haven’t yet found out what all the rules are as far as equipment goes.  I know most of the people shoot compounds, and they have different classes if you shoot with a release.  There’s an indoor league in the winter (I’m in Massachusetts), and although they have outdoor targets, they mostly seem to go in for field archery and targets at only moderate distances (no 90 meter stuff). A lot of the folks hunt & do 3D shoots, so hunting-style pin sights are popular.   I’m primarily getting back into archery because my eldest daughter is getting into it and I don’t want to just sit around.  I enjoyed it when I was a teenager, but the whole business has gotten VERY complicated since then. There’s an indoor-league shoot tomorrow night, and I will go and see what folks are using.  If I’m mostly shooting at shorter ranges, is a scope really necessary?  I’ve been thinking I could invest a little more in a sight & shoot with an aperture indoors for now, and that would give me time to study things a bit more before investing in a scope.  I don’t mind spending money on good gear, but I hate to go all out when I don’t know what to look for in terms of features & the like. Doug White – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text ->Generally, recurve bows have less vibration than compound bows. Many compound >archers use scopes which are heavier than the simple apertures and pins that >recurve shooters use. So, a compound sight is sturdier than a recurve sight. > You >can use a compound sight on a recurve but the reverse might be trouble. >Most scopes have 10/32 threads since they are sturdier. Most simple apertures >and many pins are 8-32 since they don’t have to be as sturdy. >Generally speaking you don’t need as much frame length with a compound. The >arrows go faster and the arrows don’t fall off as much with longer distances. >For most uses 4 inches is plenty for a compound. >If you have a scope/lens then changing the extension can make the view through >the scope clearer. Some folks use the extension length to compensate for bow >torque. >What you choose depends on the type of shooting you will do. If you are > shooting >FITA events then you probably end up shooting with a scope (and a peep) with a >release. I would spend a bit more and get a sturdier sight. >3D and field have classes for fingers and compounds. Some classes use pins > only. >Tell us a little bit more about what kind of archery you want to do.

Response:

A normal aperture, or pin, is fine indoors. But if you think you might want to shoot a scope in the future, don’t buy a sight which takes the 8/32 pins. – Hide quoted text — Show quoted text – > Thanks for the input.  I will probably be competing in our local club > shoots, and I haven’t yet found out what all the rules are as far as > equipment goes.  I know most of the people shoot compounds, and they > have different classes if you shoot with a release.  There’s an indoor > league in the winter (I’m in Massachusetts), and although they have > outdoor targets, they mostly seem to go in for field archery and > targets at only moderate distances (no 90 meter stuff). A lot of the > folks hunt & do 3D shoots, so hunting-style pin sights are popular.   > I’m primarily getting back into archery because my eldest daughter is > getting into it and I don’t want to just sit around.  I enjoyed it > when I was a teenager, but the whole business has gotten VERY > complicated since then. > There’s an indoor-league shoot tomorrow night, and I will go and see > what folks are using.  If I’m mostly shooting at shorter ranges, is a > scope really necessary?  I’ve been thinking I could invest a little > more in a sight & shoot with an aperture indoors for now, and that > would give me time to study things a bit more before investing in a > scope.  I don’t mind spending money on good gear, but I hate to go all > out when I don’t know what to look for in terms of features & the > like. > Doug White >Generally, recurve bows have less vibration than compound bows. Many compound >archers use scopes which are heavier than the simple apertures and pins that >recurve shooters use. So, a compound sight is sturdier than a recurve sight. > You >can use a compound sight on a recurve but the reverse might be trouble. >Most scopes have 10/32 threads since they are sturdier. Most simple apertures >and many pins are 8-32 since they don’t have to be as sturdy. >Generally speaking you don’t need as much frame length with a compound. The >arrows go faster and the arrows don’t fall off as much with longer distances. >For most uses 4 inches is plenty for a compound. >If you have a scope/lens then changing the extension can make the view through >the scope clearer. Some folks use the extension length to compensate for bow >torque. >What you choose depends on the type of shooting you will do. If you are > shooting >FITA events then you probably end up shooting with a scope (and a peep) with a >release. I would spend a bit more and get a sturdier sight. >3D and field have classes for fingers and compounds. Some classes use pins > only. >Tell us a little bit more about what kind of archery you want to do.

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